I'm 20 minutes into it right now and HOLY CRAP is all I've got too.

Edit: Erykah Badu slays me. That woman is funny as hell.

Edit: Brannon, you need to track down that Guy Forsyth dude. What a performance. You never hear that kind of stuff anymore.

I'm 45 minutes into it. I had to jump back here to say, "WOW!" This is a great documentary. Buying some Doyle Bramhall tunes from Amazon/MP3.

As Dave Mathews said, "Radio is becoming irrelevant".

EDIT: How about that harmonica at 0:54? Damn!

All I can say is WOW!

I only got half way through because my computer wasn't aligning the video with the sound right - but when my mom goes to bed I'm stealing her computer and staying up late to watch this!

Really makes us have to step back and think what GREAT Artists or Musicians are we never going to hear because the industry is so wrapped up in making a profit. I mean, it is obvious today when you turn on the radio and hear the same songs circulating every 15 minutes, the Ashley Simpsons/Jessica Simpsons/Miley Cyrus/Heidi Montags selling records and sold out concerts because these young kids aren't being exposed to what music really can offer - which is more than just the image...it's the soul, message, creativity, pushing the boundaries of what music is "supposed" to be.

It will be interesting to see in time if the Music Industry will continue down this path of image vs real musicianship or if somewhere along the way we will start to wake up and the masses will crave the culture and art and depth that we've enjoyed in the past.

Can't wait to finish this - and post it on every blog I have. lol ^_^

Seems this is classified as advanced weaponry or something similar, since it cannot be viewed outside the US. Some times I am very tempted to ... never mind. I wish all Americans happy viewing.

This is very good so far.

@Bjorn: You must have skipped the retinal scan at the beginning. THEY don't like it when you do that. :)

THEY have been after me for years... hold on, is this a secure site?

Bjorn, I am actively pursue a way for you and others to view this. Bare with me.

Many thank yous are hereby being sent your way. That's why they call you Legendary :)

Don't you just hate it when everybody else is having fun and you seem to miss out. I'm with you Bjorn....stuck in the UK under extreame censorship. Can anyine tell me if this thing is worth the cost of a Virgin flight.......?

Let's make our own, much better video and block all access from the US :). Ha! You should never have exported the Beatles and Zeppelin etc etc. They can have Alan Jackson.

@Brannon... "bare with me"?

Brannon and I like to get bare together. This is male bonding, we are not gay. Not very.

Allow me to promote the "live Music Capitol of the World". In my proud opinion, you should book LND NYC DFW AUS for SXSW in March. That is where these things find there audience. The Wek long event should be on everyones bucket list. This festival of music and film is where things like this debut.
SXSW is the place to see and hear all things that are not Ashley Simpson. It's about world class unrecognized talent representing all styles and genres. I live this town almost as much as I love kompoz.

Wow, you know almost as many airport abbreviations as I do :). You can fly STN -> NYO very cheap if you come in to LHR and take a train. Then drive from... I must be joking.

Touching. . .
Wait. No. Nevermind.

Almost everyone eats out at a fast food place more than anywhere else, but no one lists McDonalds as their favorite meal. No true chef ever aspired to get gig at McDonalds either. Attempting to compete with McDonalds for market share is an idiotic life choice and business plan. Cook yourself and a few friends a good meal, smile, and enjoy. Its as good as it gets.

Can somebody do a video capture..........or are there CR issues?

well said Dr.Cube...

Thanks for sharing this man : - )
I couldn't agree more!!

Does this work for the people who can't view it on Hulu?

Works for me in the UK Lisa Cheers!!!

Link for Bjorn and us that cant watch American feeds...

http://dotsub.com/view/4f65937e-6930-4aa1-a45a-862e006c7cfb

Provocative title.

Music isn't dead.

Great musicians are everywhere.

The cheese has moved, but every mouse will find it's cheese.

Ironic that a film about anti-commercialism is peppered with commercials (but, thanks Hulu, I understand).

Will the next Doyle Bramhall II please stand up?

Rick,

Most mice find processed American Cheese and don't know the difference.

Did you know about Doyle Bramhall before you saw this doc? If so, then you are the exception.

I was enlightened. I did not know of Doyle Bramhall before watching this... nor Erykah Badu, or Mississippi All Stars. The video is worth watching just for the music in it.

:0 You didn't know of Erykah Badu!? ^_^

Thank you very much for the alternative links! :)

This is excellent, just a third into the video. Very on topic after the Auto-Tune discussion. Those things, like Auto tune, individually aren't the problem, just the symptoms. The heart and soul of music is being cosmeticly stripped away. It's still there though, for those who explore. American cheese... that's just embarassing

This is really great, have watched it twice now :). An excellent documentary. I always find the arguments interesting, the "the record companies/radio stations only pump out commercial shit" vs "if it is shit, why do people buy it by the millions?".

Opera, in Sweden, has financial support by the government, rock music does not. Would opera die if we had to pay the actual price that it costs? If it dies, did it "deserve" to live? Will blues die because "popular music" is artificially enhanced and perfected and promoted on the radio? I hope not. I like to believe that true art will find its way, regardless of the commercial powers. I also like to think that we are not as stupid as to just "swallow" what we are "fed" by the commercial powers. I also do not subscribe to what some of my musician friends say "Yes, WE understand this, but ORDINARY people don't".

"Rap rules the world from Japan to Antarctica", i.e. Japan, maybe Taiwan, Philippines, Indonesia, maybe Malaysia and Australia (depending on the earth's curvature). I had no clue that rap ruled so hard in those countries :)

And, I want to learn how to dance like Billy Preston, MAN, that is so cool.

Rock On

B

Bjorn,
People like music. Music isn't "shit" just because its manufactured. However, if Doyle Bramahall is so well liked, why doesn't he sell any records?

Its about promotion. We aren't stupid. We might be lazy, but it shouldn't be so hard to find good music.

'I also do not subscribe to what some of my musician friends say "Yes, WE understand this, but ORDINARY people don't"'

Believe or not, some people do understand things that others don't. I do not think the makers of this doc are arrogant. They are just sharing information.

Hmmmm I did not mean to say any of that really, well apart from the "WE (the implite elite who are better) understand and THEY (the implied cretins) don't". I did not mean "understanding" as in "being able to figure out how it works" but more as an example of reverse snobbism where "my taste is better than yours because I have more cred" kind of thing. And this was NOT - repeat NOT - directed at the makers of the (see below) EXCELLENT documentary, but to friends who should know better than thinking one taste is more valid than another. Any deeper than that and I will have to argue in Swedish.

I quote myself: "This is really great, have watched it twice now :). An excellent documentary."

I did not mention or knowingly imply that there was any any arrogance anywhere (except, again, my reference to some musician friends).

My intention was to raise the question whether music will survive on its own merit or should be "supported" so that it survives (the opera example). I believe the blues will never die.

I have no clue if Doyle Bramahall is well liked or not, just as you will most likely never understand how incredibly good KSMB were.

I know that it is about promotion, and I agree with the sentiment that it would be very good if record companies and radio stations took chances, which they seem less willing to do nowadays than before. It would help to make more people aware of more variations of music, some of which will be shit to me and some of which will be genius work to me. To me. Personally.

I basically think we agree, you may have a slight upper hand, but you have the advantage of language here, so let's call it a draw :)

Or maybe call it a drawl.

And (non-sarcastically) thank you for forcing me to explain myself better, I do not always make sense :)

Rock On

B

I'm disgusted with all of it. It is hard to find music I like locally.

The radio stations play only rap, new country and classic rock. Sirius Radio will not help me renew my subscription to their service after hours on hold with them.

Walmart has essentially put record stores out of business. If I'm walking around with 20 dollars in my pocket, there is absolutely no place I can walk in and buy a Doyle Bramhall, Erykah Badu, Mississipi Allstars, or even Frank Zappa CD. No online CD sales site accepts cash, checks or money orders. It's all about instant money.

Is it a wonder so many people pirate music?

.. I was just about to write...

In one way, it is harder to find music that the record companies/radio stations do not believe "sells" today, as per Sven-Martin's example.

In another way, with the Internet, it is actually easier to find - if I may call it so - "obscure" music today than 10-15 years ago. I used to chase every recording I could find with Velvet Underground (not very obscure, but try finding them in Sweden), and in the last 3-5 years I have found more of them (on the web) than the previous 20 years of hunting.

Hmmm

.. and then again :). Do we not have a certain amount of possible power through a place like Kompoz? Are we not light years ahead of the record labels, really? I would be willing to bet a reasonable amount of money that if all Kompoz members made a concerted effort to get a CD by one or more of our members "out there", we would be a force that could not be ignored.

Is that a challenge?

It could be. But then again, we could also complain about how bad things are instead :)

It would be very interesting to see what kind of propaganda machine we could get together to promote (for example) Mr Kresling's album.

We are in a few countries and I guess every kompozer has some kind of tie/contact with the music biz, even if it is just other local musicians.

If we were to target, for example, Austin, Texas and every Kompozer sent an e-mail to a selected radio station asking to hear The Beast That Swallows Its Young. What would happen? There must be other, better, assault tactics too. Someone in here must have a marketing degree? I am an electronics engineer.

The affection I have for this town is more about its culture than about its music. I am originally from a small hick town. I was too old when I was finally exposed to the things I have seen and heard here.
There is a record store here, perched on some of the most expensive real estate in Texas, where a person can buy just about anything. This is a rare gift.

Having said that, I enjoy pop music as well as subculture music. - Not the Ashley Simpsons, but the power pop coming from the UK. I am guilty of eating out of the spoon served to me. But if I like it, I like it. Thats ok.

But, as an example, I do myself a tremendous disservice if I don't take an effort to know who exactly who Bob Dylan is and what he has meant to music. I learned this by people who were educated. The arrogance is for teenagers. I'm wise to it.

My children will know The Beatles. Thats my job. They will know the connections that Beatle music has to Buddy Holly. They will know the connection the Bruce Springsteen has to Dylan, and Dylan to Woody Guthry.

They can go see Simpson girls if they choose, but not until they know the rest of the story.

I'm an economist, which means I'm totally useless. I'd certainly be interested in hearing ideas. The one you mention sounds good -- at least on a micro level.

@Brannon: Amen. We do agree and I need to improve my ability to express what I want to say.

@Emmett: It would be very interesting.

so what do you call someone who can create interesting "music" in a studio setting but cannot create it live on a stage?

Well i woudl have to say that being on stage now days doesn't hurt, but time and time again its been proved that there are other ways of being noticed. The Internet has opened up not one price is right show, but millions, and you never know how many doors you can choose to open. Its all about giving away the best candies when they get in the door. This way they will come back for more, and bring their friends with them. :)

@Billy: Milli Vanilli

Thanks B1.. I always thought MV was underrated
Billy Vanilli

Just for fun..
Now that we have our DAW's and all the neat tools that enable us to create interesting music in our homes, how is that music different from live performances? Are those who cannot/do not perform live just shysters in Logic(or any DAW) clothing? How many songs on Kompoz are created with the assistance of careful re-tracking and editing which is essentially invisible in the final tracks. How many great sounding tracks/songs would be impossible (or nearly so) to do live? And if technical gymnastics are used to create a track, is it because the musician's lack of ability required it? Musicianship can be well hidden in the depths of the computer. But does that invalidate a beautiful piece of music?
My own opinion is a carefully guarded secret.

Just a quick comment on the radio in the UK. I grew up listening to john peel's radio show from being as young as i can remember.I used to record the shows on cassette tapes in case i missed the name of the bands he played as he would not play anything that had been played by any other radio presenter so every track was new to hear from every genre of music. After he passed away i have never switched on the radio since. I wish someone would follow in his footsteps.

Well i do a lot of tunes live that are close to the original but honestly a lot of them are just close enough to get by with for a bunch of people that are half way drunk. Anyways no one seems to care as long as you play free bird at the end of the gig. I have been thinking about a new idea that this discussion has spurred in my mind. Which i would call virtual band live performances in bars and clubs on a video screen which can inter react at the same time. The establishments woudl pay for live performances that woudl be real time from featured internet bands. Or for this instance the kompoz band. This could work for a platform like ejamming or ninjam but would have to have video interaction. This could be either done by studios around thew world for this service or by individuals from their home. This would open up a whole new can of worms for how we could listen to music and almost feel like your there. Any thoughts on this idea?
I feel this is capable with todays technology but no one has yet tried it..why not be the first!!!

@Billy

I hear what your saying about people who only create online using editing programs and loops or their personal studios - but are unable to perform live. Does this discredit their musicianship? or make them "less" of a musician...

Call me crazy - and I'm sure many old school musician would disagree with me...but I believe both are/can be great musicians. For example, I went to a music school for four years and I learned roman numeral analysis, arranging, jazz keys, classical piano, trumpet, studio...blah blah blah. lol. My teachers were pretty strict and believed you could only call yourself a musician if "you put in your dues"

define musician: someone who plays a musical instrument (as a profession)

With technology changing and expanding it's easier for people to create. weather their actually playing their trumpet...or using a program arranging pre-made sound loops. with $150 I was able to have my own - "mini studio" with a Snowball usb mic and Mixcraft. Most of what I've been creating lately is using loops and I'm learning how to use effects to get the sounds or soundscapes I want. then I can add vocals and invite others in to add real instruments if they'd like - but being able to perform these songs on stage...no, I honestly can say I couldn't unless I had the track playing behind me at the local coffee shop while I sang.

I LOVE MUSIC! and I Love to be creative - I have the "ability" to play piano, guitar, trumpet, and sing live but with my move down here I've found it VERY hard to find people to play with or start a band to get that opportunity of live performance or gigs. I've gone out many friday and saturday nights to both coffee shops and bars talked with band members gave them my info and musical background to try to get the ball rolling or musical connections but with no luck...they probably look at me and think "hmm, she's just a young girl who wants to be the next Britney Spears" So I come to kompoz where I can actually work with other musicians and I use my loop library when I'm feeling creative. I don't think that makes me less of a musician though just because I don't have the live performances under my belt yet.

a musician is someone who plays a musical instrument (professionally) well, is it fair to say that technology has evolved into a sort of new musical instrument? Could it be possible that these editing programs are new age instruments being used to create new kinds of music? kind of a weird concept but makes sense to me. lol

I'm not saying that one is better than the other - just that times are changing and people who can navigate around an editing program with ease and true knowledge of how it all works have to learn and practice just as much as someone who practices scales with their trumpet each day. I wont deny that theres something that could never replace organic/live instruments or performance but also I think an electronic piece could be just as beautiful and full of emotion.

well said... hopefully music is perfectly valid regardless of whether it's made on stage or in the closet, like me. It doesn't matter what tools are used, electronic or otherwise. The issues I have are with the general move toward fake-ness. I'd much rather appreciate Joe Cocker convulsing to get a song out than some American Idol type who is more focused on a sassy facial expression than the actual music. That kind of stuff is hand in hand with lip synching, auto tuning, etc. It's a sad direction for music, musicians, and creativity. BUT... there's more great music than ever, it just doesn't come in the pretty packaging

imo the problem is guys who practice brainwash and lie to sell anything....music,tech and all are innocent :)

I associate music with art I think different textures of sound are used to create an image in the mind much like paint is used to create an image on canvas. This same argument can be applied to art due to real artists losing work through technology like photoshop, but however you paint your music it is how well it is painted that determines how good it is. I'm sure if i was to choose between a handpainted picture and a computer generated one i would most likely choose the handpainted one because of it's raw talent, but i can also appreciate that using a computer to draw still requires some artistic knowledge it's just a tool to get the end results much quicker. As with computer generated music you still need the musical knowledge to make it stand out from other artists.

Very interesting movie... A major thunderstorm came through the area about half way through and I lost the electric so I had to come back to finish watching... I turned off the "radio" years ago... Now about 98% of the music that I listen to is right here at Kompoz created by some very talented musicians from around the world that I would have never had the opportunity to hear had it not been for technology and this site...

I am a musician at heart... Mind, body and soul although my "day" job is something else... Most all of what I kopmoz I actually play... I play two instruments and I "use" to do it live at the same time... With the tools at my disposal having to do this is not necessary and I can kompoz pieces of music that is completely physically impossible for me to play live... This problem was solved centuries before the computer was invented... You will find that it was completely physically impossible for Beethoven to preform his entire 5th symphony as written... But he was still able to put together this beautiful master piece even being deaf without the aid of a computer... I do sometimes use the mouse to write music, does this make me less of a musician than Beethoven was??? Maybe no where near as good but not less of a musician... Most of my "live" performing days are behind me but perhaps one day I will write an entire symphony...

Thanks Lisa..well said. one of the reasons I was even prompted to ask those questions was that in watching "Before the Music Dies" it struck me how it focused on live performances. I think the technical advances (DAW's) in music have become an integral part of the current creative musical experience and, I think, Kompoz exists as an example of one form of a new music "business" model, one where clearly the music comes first not the commercial potential.

Certainly the technology has evolved to where it can be perceived and used as a new "instrument" and certainly an electronic piece can be beautiful.. but what happens when the technology allows for deceit and subterfuge. I can make my guitar playing sound technically vastly better by editing 3 or 4 different tracks together than would ever be possible on stage. I can "correct" mistakes.. and I can even play without choking, fainting, or sweating... none of which would be possible were I to step on a stage.
So I ask, somewhat tongue-in-cheek, isn't my music then a deceit, no matter how beautiful? and should anyone really care? I am not sure whether I do or not but I wonder how the musicians in the movie would feel.

It may be deceit, but that is not very new. The guitar solo in Stairway to Heaven (1971) has been voted the best guitar solo in the world a few times. It is a composite of more than one take, and was overdubbed after the recording was done. Deceit?

That's true of much studio work.. but I suspect he managed to play a decent version of it when on stage. In the end, perhaps it's best to just do what you can do and not worry too much about what you can't do.

I wonder how many would agree that the "mistakes" in music can be even more beautiful than a digitally altered to perfection track. I know I've said it before that I would rather hear a singer sing with emotion and go a little out of key in the midst of passion than someone who sang perfectly in tune with no passion at all.

although, my old teachers seemed to be only focused on how perfectly in tune someone could sing and based what vocal jazz groups ppl got into on that alone. To me, it just sounded like a bunch of robots afraid to sing with any emotion for fear of going out of tune. lol

Gee what about KISS alive or is it memorex.

thanks Bran and lisa for posting it for outside the US
here here plant the cornershop firmly back in music.

The important distinction that hasn't been made for me is the difference between an artist and a musician. There are artists that are musicians, but for me most musicians aren't artists; they're technicians. Typically, if your hired for a recording session as a musician, it's assumed you'll play what someone else has envisioned. That's usually why one would go to music school, to learn how to be a technician at your craft. Artistry, to me, comes when you take your technical skill and create something fresh and innovative. How good that technical skill is might not matter. If I hired an artist for the recording session, I expect they'll bring their vision to the table.

All of these high tech tools would have been used by the "greats" long ago if the technology were there. It's simply a technical tool for putting the artistry together. The paintbrush doesn't paint itself on the canvas. The first monks who recorded their chants via notation were employing technology to document their work. They'd have ProTooled it if they could.

Sometimes I'm employing a technical skill and (a few) times it's artistry. This is a very debatable opinion, but I think all the folks interviewed in the video are artists. The rest are the musicians that glue it all together bringing the magic to life.

Here's an interesting article on the song death of autotune:

http://www.synthtopia.com/content/2009/06/30/jay-zs-doa-death-of-auto-tune/

and one in praise of auto tune:

http://www.synthtopia.com/content/2009/05/06/in-praise-of-auto-tune/