Sound Engineering & Recording

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JMurad / Jim Murad 3yr+10mo ago
Looking for a little guidance since the aspect of having someone else mix/master is fairly new to me. If I have a collaboration with 30 tracks - do I need to upload all 30 as seps in order to have a mix done? What's the best or preferred way to go about doing this? Any help/insight would be appreciated.


   

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HeavyVibrationSudioPL   commented 3yr+10mo ago


That is the way you do it here.All seps one after one and they should be in zero point on your project.I download only seps i work at the moment with to avoid confusion.

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JMurad   commented 3yr+10mo ago


Thanks Heavy. I know I should add a sync tone for all of them but what do you mean by zero point?

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sriracha   commented 3yr+10mo ago


dragged all the way left in the DAW, but that's useless if they are all different formats - e.g. some tracks are windows wav, some mp3, some broadcast wav. That's why sync is used.

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JMurad   commented 3yr+10mo ago


Thanks Sriracha. BTW - I've been working with xd238 (Ken) on a couple of projects. I think he said you two knew each other pretty well. He said you come highly recommended so maybe you'd be interested in jumping in at some point. Still a ways from being ready to mix tho.

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sriracha   commented 3yr+10mo ago


yep - Ken and I go way back. He's very creative and talented.

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JMurad   commented 3yr+10mo ago


agreed. it's been fun working with him.

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xd238   commented 3yr+10mo ago


Bill is busy in private town with his excellent "The Sundered World" project. He occasionally comes out for the occasional comment. Hell, he won't even go out and see Allan Holdsworth, I'm hoping he has time to work on the mix of my feature track "Up and Over". And also eventually let me know where he really lives ;)

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JMurad   commented 3yr+10mo ago


Ok, probably a stupid question, but if I drag all of the tracks to the far left (zero point) how does the mix engineer know where they go in the arrangement? Obvious they can listen to it, but it seems like it would be a lot more complicated. Is that not the case?

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xd238   commented 3yr+10mo ago


I think Jim thats assuming all of the tracks are left justified like a bounce in place, and they span the whole arrangement

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sriracha   commented 3yr+10mo ago


So: If all the files are exported from the same DAW, and all the file formats are the same (e.g. all wav, or mp3, whatever) then in theory when imported into another DAW, all the tracks will be aligned. I've learned the hard way to never assume anything. I use syncs on everything. :D

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dogbizkits   commented 3yr+10mo ago


In Pro Tools there's something called 'Consolidate Track'. There will be something similar in other DAW's; What this lets you do is get all the individual pieces of a track which have been recorded in various segments on a track and then turn them into a left-justified track with no breaks between the segments. Learning how to place sync markers correctly is pretty essential though - as Bill has pointed out. It's not as difficult as one would imagine. I believe there's a tutorial on sync somewhere on Kompoz.

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HeavyVibrationSudioPL   commented 3yr+10mo ago


They should start like in session.All in the order.You should not have to put them like they should start.If seps are moved than seps are bad.I move seps after i work with them but it should be in order when you download them to DAW.

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sriracha   commented 3yr+10mo ago


Ideally you post each sep individually. You should use sync tones. That's less of an issue if every sep comes from you but if you have collaborators, hopefully you used sync tones. You should post a ref track that shows where you think the mix should go if you have an opinion at all. You should expect, as should the person doing the mix, that as you are not all in the control room together, it's an iterative process. The mixer does a mix and looks for your feedback. You go back and forth until it's where you want it to be. That back and forth is what happens as a normal part of mixing when you are physically in a studio - no reason not to expect that here.

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HeavyVibrationSudioPL   commented 3yr+10mo ago


Good advice.Buy i was not using this at all.

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dogbizkits   commented 3yr+10mo ago


Of course.... the tracks should be uploaded at the resolution they were recorded at. A mix engineer won't [usually] work from MP3's when a higher resolution file is available. If the tracks start at different time positions, a new 'zero point' will need to be established. That's done by inserting sync markers so that the tracks can be lined up on another DAW.

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JMurad   commented 3yr+10mo ago


Thanks for all of the info guys. I'm sure someone will set me straight if I screw something up. :)

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HeavyVibrationSudioPL   commented 3yr+10mo ago


I like you.And i will ask for advice.I know you will lough..Lets say we have Guitars left and right.On left i have EQ and other plagins.And i want the same on Right guitar.Than i start from beginning on right guitar track but i know i can copy and paste from fader to fader and...i dint know how to do it...:( Logic Pro 9

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RicardoCamargo   commented 3yr+10mo ago


If you want the same treatment for 2 or more tracks, you can send them to a bus, and do all the treatment there. Just make sure it's a stereo bus, then you can pan them the way you want

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dogbizkits   commented 3yr+10mo ago


Like Ricardo says.... that's the most common way. If the guitars are dissimilar sounding, they'd be best handled individually for better separation.

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JMurad   commented 3yr+10mo ago


How about volume levels wet/dry, etc? Like, if I have something set at -3db on the track with lots of reverb, echo, whatever...how do you guys generally like to get the seps?

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HeavyVibrationSudioPL   commented 3yr+10mo ago


Good question.I will tell you how i work.Download a all mix.Listen to it and see people are using delay reverb and this is the imagination style.But a singer will send you a voice with his vission of reverb recording in his house.And i discover that reverbs have own not only space but sound/colour.And they don't much in the mix.And i know that guitarist wants this to be on track so i have to much them myself.And it results in compromising.Vocal space or guitar space first and together they create a sound i don't want in the mix.With all mix buss reverb problems grow.So here is solution.Tell what you want to be on your guitar and send track dry like a desert.With all drums and sound enginer will make it much better than it was made in the house.I had this problem with track The Military Widow.I wanted guitars to be louder bit it was not possible.Anyway i have made a good mix.

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RicardoCamargo   commented 3yr+10mo ago


Always good to upload dry tracks, no reverb or delay, cause there's no turning back from that. Also no eq, compression, etc. it's always good to upload the track the way it was recorded. That's what I think.

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HeavyVibrationSudioPL   commented 3yr+10mo ago


100% truth.You want to have a good mix you need to listen to this advice.Send seps dry to the enginer but in general idea you can put evect to show what do you need to be done.Seps dry like a desert. :)

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dogbizkits   commented 3yr+10mo ago


Jim. There's a lot of info on my profile page regarding the way most mix engineers [generally] like the tracks to be before importing into their production DAW's for online collaborations. If you'd like to take a look, I'm sure it'll cover the most FAQ's.

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GibsonGoldtop   commented 3yr+10mo ago


What if someone considers delay, reverb, chorus, etc. integral to their guitar sound? Would you then consider using a solo'd reference track, with said effects, from the player as an inspirational starting point?

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RicardoCamargo   commented 3yr+10mo ago


All this can be added later in the mix, exactly how the musician wants. Like I said, there's no turning back. You can record a kick ass melting face solo with delay, reverb, etc, but when you put it in the mix, it just doesn't sit right. Then what you're gonna do? It might work, it might not work, and you can get the result you want adding all that magic during the mix. Now, some people add wah in the end, that I never did, and I feel like that's something it should be recorded, not added later.

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sriracha   commented 3yr+10mo ago


I would say that as long as there's no verb, it's probably workable. Verb ruins everything. But also note that delays can be tough. I don't mind chorus on guitar - in fact I don't mind wet-ish guitar. But a dry track and a ref mix, well, I can recreate what you have going on, probably. I guess that when it comes to a "sound" I'm ok getting that sound - just no verb. :) But I also like to work with people and sometimes get something close to their sound that allows me to work it in. But I get the whole "sound" thing - I'm a guitarist. I don't generally like people messing with my sound either. :D

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JMurad   commented 3yr+10mo ago


Thanks Rab, I did check out your profile and that was very helpful, and a lot to absorb :-) I'm guessing there will be some trial and error until I get the hang of that.

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dogbizkits   commented 3yr+10mo ago


There's an abundance of knowledge on Kompoz; never be afraid to ask questions, Jim. We're a pretty friendly bunch here :o)

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sriracha   commented 3yr+10mo ago


You want your seps to be bone dry: no wet effects at all if you can. Certainly vocals should be dry like that. In general, you want to avoid verb, delay, chorus - any of that and also avoid eq and compressions on seps - let your mixer handle that stuff.

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JMurad   commented 3yr+10mo ago


This is all great info guys. Thanks. Looking forward to putting it into practice soon.

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DonnieAlan   commented 3yr+10mo ago


Well, yes and no. It depends greatly on what is being used on a particular track and for what, especially with synth sounds. Sometimes (often, in fact) chorus/flange/phase/delay/special fx type effects are part of the actual sound...making the sound the unique sound desired for the track. In that instance, leave those in. Reverb & compression and other post-sound processing, not so much...not usually key to the actual sound. Quite often when I design a particular patch from a VI or one of my hardware synths for a track, certain effect elements become part of how I tweak the sound to what I want it to be. I would normally leave all those as is when uploading that type of track. "Dry" doesn't necessarily have to be "bone dry" if the fx are part of the actual sound for the track. YMMV. Just a caveat on that one.

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sriracha   commented 3yr+10mo ago


yeah - synth stuff is different as that stuff is part of the sound. Still - you don't want verb. :)

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DonnieAlan   commented 3yr+10mo ago


or adverbs...or nouns, adjectives or dangling participles. :-O

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