6 people like this:
vocal seems a bit loud to me, there is also some compressor pumping when the stick hits the snare rim that causes
the rest or most of the music to lower in volume slightly.
hope this helps you out Jan,
its very nice song.
I was going a bit back and forward on where to have the vocals in the mix. I think there's a compressor on the snare which could use a bit of tweaking, but I didn't know if it was only me obsessing over it.
Thanks for listening :)
Nice recording. I agree the vocal could be set back a bit more in the mix.. vocal a bit dry maybe a touch more reverb.
Thanks! I'll have to look into it again :)
Only a few small things to consider to help the dynamics (in particular), Jannik.
The vocals are a bit loud - which isn't letting the other instruments 'breathe'.
May be worth trying to get more 'air' into the vocals by extending the top end and reducing the overall volume. This is more a compensatory move just to help reveal more instrumentation 'ear candy'.
The snare doesn't 'fit', unfortunately (imho). It needs a more clean sound (less compressed - or no compression) as the present snare is pretty muffled and dead. If the snare can be substituded with a better sample, that may be the key to fixing this clarity issue. Possibly add a little long-tail (subtle) delayed reverb to it. Other than those things, everything sounds pretty well put together.
dont forget ButterCup is on vox...
she likes them up!
Hi Rab! Thanks for the detailed reply - it's always great to get input from you :)
I'll try to bring out the voc with eq rather than volume to see if that does the trick. It was difficult to get them to sit where I wanted which I guess is why they ended up being too loud.
I'm quite happy with the sound of the snare but maybe I can ease off a bit of the compression and add some reverb. It Is a bit dead! :)
Thanks for listening Rab! :)
Okay guys: I've updated the mix and hope that I've addressed some of the issues that you pointed out earlier. Let me know what you think and thanks for your help! :)
An improvement for sure. You're nearly there, Jannik. The last thing I'd do would be to spend some time carefully manually automating (gain riding) the vocal amplitude phrase-by-phrase so that the less distinct ones can be brought up in level. This isn't a dynamics 'thing'.... some of the phrases are just too indistinct. You can't rely on a compressor to fix this on its own: Do it with automation mainly - although you can suppliment the process with gentle compression to take down some transients prior to arriving at the channel fader. This is something I've done to lead vocals for a long time.... it really makes a huge difference in vocal intelligability and makes 'delicate' vocals really shine. It can take a bit of time to do it, but it's worth the extra effort. Get that sorted out and you can put this one in its box. I hope this helps a bit :)
100%! Vocals: treat them by hand. I do this with any vocal track, as long as I produce:-).
I'll have to make a note of that! I saw a plugin from waves call vocal rider or something to that effect. Maybe a good investment for the future :)
2 of the best investments I've ever made to cut back mixing time with vocals are 1- Melodyne: where I can adjust pitch, formants and etc ... timing and most directly, velocity where I keep as much natural inflections made by the singer as possible. 2- Vocal Rider: after Melodyning the tracks, I use a medium ride first to keep things in check, then strap on another right after it with a smooth ride. All you need after are De-esser/compressor and EQ in the best arrangement you can perceive.
These are made into a preset into any vocal channel I work on.
Furthermore, you can write the riding of the Rider on an automation track and then tweak it afterwards ... GENIUS !!!
I call it Ride and Tweak !!!
All leads and backups are submitted to this preset chain in all my work.
Again ... GENIUS !
I use the Waves Vocal rider plugin, Jannik. It's very handy for saving some time when setting up mixes - and it can certainly can help even-out a group of backing vocals - BUT, tempting as it is (and I've tried it on lead vocals)... it just doesn't cut it for me. I prefer to go in phrase-by-phrase and manually level-ride the fader/s. If a lead vocal track has been recorded well, it deserves the extra time to get it right in the mix. You can 'get away with it' using the bass rider plugin (which I also have and use), but I always end up taking it out once the mix is 'cooking'. Both plugins are very easy to use and are certainly worth having.
Thanks Rab! I did do that in some places already but I think you're right that it could be much more. On the other hand I try not to obsess about small details if they don't bother anyone else. Therefore it's also good to get feedback :)
The pianist suggested that we add some lead guitar fills + BUVs but I'll have to see if still fits in - any thoughts on that?
It's a question of 'where do you stop'..., Jannik. If you add something [like lead guitars] you're taking some of the original 'character' away and possibly diluting some areas of the soundscape. Don't get me wrong though... I love guitars and 'bigger' drums and a more rock influenced sound - so I'd mix this completely different. At the end of the day it's how the artist envisages the sound/production - and that's the principal direction to go initially. Nonetheless, some artists can get a bit adventurous though and maybe want to push themselves out of their comfort zone so as to develop their art and craft into new areas - while others are content to play safe. I remember an interview with Steven Wilson [Porcupine Tree] expressing exactly that because he didn't want to be stuck in a rut and wanted a producer to 'push' him out of that comfort zone. At the end of the day your music speaks to you and lets you know which way it wants to go. That's certainly how I feel from a production perspective - but I could be talking bollocks :-)
vox r sitting right on>
Read dogs comment> and yea not a bad idea to walk the vox thru phrase by phrase to keep the level very even.. as long as you dont kill the emotion in it.. somethings are ment to be emphasized...
Only music suggestion.. would be to look at the akstik gtr > the sound is pristine...
but it seems to have some reoccuring notes that due to freq and pos picking overly pop out while other dont..
and this I think can be solve with a closer look at any compression you might have on it.. it needs to smooth a wee bit.. maybe a little higher ratio.. and a little more make up gain... I think if you can even the vox as dog suggested and make that intro guitar god level... (which will carry thru the song) its gold baby!! lololol Great song btw with great performances.. butters killed it...
Thanks for the tip! The compression became audible when I tried to increase it. Maybe I can automate it so that the threshold is lowered after the intro...? Hmmm... Will give it a go! :)
Oh and thanks for the kind words man! Really appreciate it! :)